Working as a Sport Physical Therapist in the NFL with Aaron Borgmann - Episode 6

Working in professional sports is a dream of many physical therapists. Here's what it's like working in the NFL.

In this week's episode of The Sports Physical Therapy Podcast, I talk with Aaron Borgmann who worked in the NFL for 12 seasons.  We discuss his experience, what it's like working in the NFL, and some tips on getting started working in professional sports.

Full show notes: https://mikereinold.com/working-as-a-sport-physical-therapist-in-the-nfl-with-aaron-borgmann

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Transcript

Introduction: 0:34

On this episode of the sports physical therapy podcast. I am joined by Aaron Boardman. Aaron's a physical therapist and athletic trainer that works in the nfl for 12 seasons in this episode we talk about his experience what life is like working in the nfl and some tips on getting into professional sports

Mike: 1:01

Hey, Aaron, what's going on. Welcome to the podcast.

Aaron: 1:04

I'm good, Mike, thanks for having me for today.

Mike: 1:06

heck is exciting. It's not every day that you get to hang out with somebody. That had spent so long at the professional sport level, especially in the NFL, which is a really challenging job. But for 12 years in there, It's not everyday. You get to hang out with somebody like yourself, but I also feel like you and I share so many similarities that, uh, it's funny. I feel like I'm just talking to myself with a lot of our conversations. So hopefully this will be a really good, uh, conversation where we just go back and forth and agree with each other. Right.

Aaron: 1:36

I would think so. Yeah. I mean, it's been, it's been a wild ride. Uh, I don't think that I could have ever imagined that life would have brought me to this point. I just knew forever that I wanted to work in the NFL full-time and I did that and I. You know, when it got to the end of my personal time, I didn't accomplish any one particular set of goals. It was more of a feeling that I wanted to advance to do other things in life. And, you know, that was both personal and professional. And I never, in a million years envisioned opening up my own business, but here we are four years later and we're sometimes flying by the seat of our pants sometimes with a little bit of structure. So.

Mike: 2:13

and that, that's how it goes. Right. You learn by experience and you're somebody that's so used to putting their head down and grind, but also. Right. Like, there is no option for fail, right? If, if things don't go well, you pivot and you, you come back ahead and I think that's what makes all of us, you know, you know, all of us really appreciate people like yourself. So. so Boardman rehab solutions. That's your new private practice that you've been doing for the last few years? How's everything going?

Aaron: 2:41

Yeah, it's good. Uh, looking back, the name needs a lot of help. I probably would've never done that again, but that's what I ended up on. And I was like, oh yeah, this will be great for that. So yes, a private practice here in Kansas city, Missouri, uh, take on all clients, not just athletes. Um, mobile by design. I don't have an office. I work out on my truck. I put everything I need for the day in my truck. I go to a house or a. Or an office sometimes I see literally everybody from eight to 80, um, you know, uh, we'll take care of any condition within, you know, my feeling that I'm good at. So I do a lot of referring out still to this day. Uh, you know, all the time he, John guys here in town loved me because every time I see a baseball player, like, uh, you better go over that way,

Mike: 3:25

Right.

Aaron: 3:26

I have another Tommy Johnson's college. So, um, you know, uh, been doing good stuff here, uh, like the direction that we're going as an entity, um, you know, just trying to see where the world takes us.

Mike: 3:38

I love it. And from spending 12 years with probably the least amount of autonomy possible, you now are in a position where you have some sort of autonomy of your day. So congratulations for that.

Aaron: 3:52

Yeah, for sure. Uh, I could have told you, um, on a Tuesday at three 30 in the afternoon in November, what I'd be doing every year, and then now it's like, yeah, some days I want to, uh, you know, be the marketing guy, cause I'm a one man business. Now some days I have to be the accounting guy. Some days I have to be the clinician some days I'm the guy that tells the boss that I want to go play golf. So, you know, there's a little bit of everything and. You know, there's a lot of self responsibility that comes with that, um, which I'm not great at. And I have to really bear down, but, uh, you know, it's been, it's been a really cool challenge to try to take on something different in life that I never thought I was going to do.

Mike: 4:30

Of course, of course. And, and heck, I feel like we just, uh, outlined your next, uh, episode that you're a guest on, because I think we could talk about this model that you've built, because I do think a lot of people are, you know, there's a lot more entrepreneurial spirit. Now, a lot of people that want to have autonomy over their lives, I feel like we can almost have a podcast where we're talking about. But to me, the big, low hanging fruit for you obviously is heck man, you you're in the NFL for 12 years. And there's a lot of stuff we need to talk about for that. Right? So lots of students, early career professionals, they all want to get in pro sports and a ton want to get into football, right? I'm sure you see that all the time. I don't have as good of advice. Actually, we just had one of our students just get a job in the NFL. So that was cool to see. Um, but uh, for me, I don't have as much experience with the NFL. So w why don't we start with this? Because I think hearing, people's almost like evolution story, I think, is sometimes helpful for some of the young people to see what it takes to get in there. But why don't you start by just telling us a little bit about your story? Like, how did you break into the NFL?

Aaron: 5:30

Yeah, so, and I'm dual credentialed PTAT um, in back when I got my 80 certification, there was this thing called the internship group, which doesn't exist anymore.

Mike: 5:40

too. Me too. Don't tell

Aaron: 5:42

of those guys. Yeah, no,

Mike: 5:43

Yeah, me too.

Aaron: 5:43

to tell you. Um, you know, it's sent from, I did all my hours in the athletic training room. I sat for my exam, the whole nine yards. I got lucky. I was going to school in St. Louis at St. Louis university, uh, extra credit, if anybody knows what a Billiken actually is. Um, I, uh, well, it's, uh, it's a mythical creature, like a leprechaun, just FYI. Um, but so I was, uh, very fortunate and got two consecutive summer fall internships with the St. Louis Rams, uh, back when they were still. Uh, finished PT school. Uh, I actually had a cup of coffee, uh, in the NFL Europe world. And, uh, got, was supposed to go to Germany during 2006 during the world cup season in Germany. So I was really, really excited about that. And then the Philadelphia Eagles called me two weeks before training camp for NFL. Europe said, Hey, we have a job. Do you want it? I go, uh, yeah. But I have this other thing. We did some negotiation. We got out of that. Um, I went to training camp for NFL Europe for a couple of weeks til they found my replacement. Um, moved to Philadelphia sight unseen. Um, had never been to the city of Philadelphia, started working for the Eagles and NovaCare there in Philadelphia at the time, uh, spent seven years. Um, we, we kind of knew things were going south. Uh, my last season there with the front office and the coaching staff, um, thought we might be getting out as an entity, as a family at that time, uh, coach Reed then got hired here in Kansas city, or like, yes, going back closer to home. Um, and so kind of begged, borrowed and stole my way. Uh, I had a lot of sleepless nights during that time period for, as a family, uh, spent five great years here and Kansas city is the second in command on the medical staff, as far as athletic training, physical therapists, ghosts, um, Did a, did a lot of really cool rehabs and cool things here that I had never done before, because I did have so much, um, you know, responsibility here as, uh, as opposed to Philadelphia where I was lower on the food chain. And you know, after five years and my kids getting a little bit older and my wife's career taking off, I decided to pivot and it was a big pivot. I had a contract in hand and I said, you know what, I'm going to go do something else. Um, but

Mike: 7:51

A lot, a lot of respect for that.

Aaron: 7:53

to, to bring it back to your quick, thank you very much to bring it back to your. I got lucky. I was in the right spot at the right time after putting in a ton of internship hours and resume building. And I'll be the first to tell you, it was a little bit of luck to play this role too, but I, you know, I believe in kind of making your own luck a little bit. By stacking all those things and saying, yes, I will go do this for nothing. Yes. I will stick my head in here. And yes, I will ask those questions and, you know, eventually some of that led to some good stuff. That's a very long-winded answer. I know it is, but that's what I gave for you.

Mike: 8:27

No. And, and heck, you know, that last part right there, I think was actually really powerful because, you. know, I, I struggle with that internally a lot too. And when I reflect on some of the experiences I've been through in some of my other friends, because I do say the same thing that, Yeah. I got super lucky. Right? There's, there's a lot of things, but man, you and I, we, we put ourselves in position to. Have luck fall on us. Right? Is that, is that, is that almost like a way of saying, like, there was still a lot of effort by us, like to work on that and like you said, it's cumulative. I thought that was really neat. It's almost like, yes, you still need luck. But we almost like really, really like tried to increase the odds of it happening by all those cumulative things we did.

Aaron: 9:08

Yeah, look, we all need luck in life. And I think people that say things like, you know, there's no such thing as luck as all hard work. Well, yeah, there's everybody works hard for the most part. I mean, I don't think that anybody's going to tell you that if they're they love what they do, that they don't work hard at. But you still right place, right? Time is real. It really is. And you know, w the irony being a real quick story is that I got lucky because a coach in Philadelphia took an athletic trainer with him to minister. And then they needed a spot. So then I filled into the spot and Philadelphia, seven years later that coach's back on our staff in Kansas city. I said, you've never met me and you don't know me, but you caused me to be in the NFL and you didn't even know it. So thank you.

Mike: 9:49

Right.

Aaron: 9:50

and he and I are great friends now. Um, even though I didn't meet him until eight years into my journey, but he caused me to have the journey. So, you know, that's just the weird thing about professional sports as you well know, everybody kind of knows each other in a goggles. to your point, you got to put yourself in a position when the time comes for someone to do the choosing that you stand out and that you have the ability to separate yourself from your experiences. And the gentleman that hired me said, look, I hired you because you had these experiences. And because you had somebody on your resume whose name I knew, and I trusted point blank end of discussion. And I was like, yeah, now let's run with it. Let's go.

Mike: 10:26

Right. And it's funny again, you said right place right time, but there was probably eight other people in that same place at that same time, too. Right. So it's again, is there luck for Sure. but there's a lot of just putting yourself in that position to succeed. And I think, I think you should be really proud of that. Um, I'm not sure how NFL. Feels about this, but I think it worked out well for you. Right. But, um, I think I know your former boss then, because I was down in Birmingham, uh, where we took care of all NFL Europe, which is kind of, kind of ironic. So Mayfield Armstrong, he, uh, he's a, he's the man, but he, uh, yeah, he was, I, you know, I'll have to think back in time if he was really upset at that time, but I felt like he was in a bad mood right around that time. And maybe, maybe this is why it's because he left them high

Aaron: 11:36

sure it wasn't me.

Mike: 11:38

Well, that was probably the last year of the ex uh, I, wow. I said XFL, but, uh, NFL Europe right. Was XFL too. But, um, but that was kind of going on his way out anyway. Yeah. But awesome. So, so again, I think hearing people's like origin stories, I think it's super helpful. You started off with internships and you got that through your school. Is that.

Aaron: 12:00

Uh, yeah, so we had context through our school. Wasn't a program through the school. Like you had to actually go out and like apply for it yourself and take the initiative and do all that. And I had previously had one through P bats with the Cardinals in St. Louis as a summer internship, where I sat in the dugout all summer, which I thought was awesome. Decided to baseball, wasn't going to be for me because of the time commitment. And somehow I got the, the, the thought in my head that, oh yeah, the NFL is a lot better time commitment than baseball and quickly found out that, you know, it's all about the same in roundabout. But, um, decided that I wanted to do training camp and fall internships. Now, normally training camp internships is where it stops, but because I lived pretty close to the complex, I just started dropping by during the week and they didn't tell me no. So I just kept going, probably annoyed some people, but I got a lot of experience out of it. My face was always there. My name was in the, you know, conversation all the time. So, you know, just kept doing things until people told me to stop.

Mike: 13:00

I, and you know what, I can't tell you how many people share that very same experience that you just said that, that I know. So, I mean, obviously that's a very powerful thing. If so many people kind of felt that same way. So, uh, you know, good tidbit for people out there, you got to put yourself out there, you got to get in front of people and you get to donate your time. I think, you know, that's, that's such an important thing and it's getting harder, right? Everybody's in so much student debt right now, but you can still find. To donate your time and to do that because that's how you get to that right place. So you can be there at the right time. I think that's, that's important. Um, a lot's changed right in the league since you got started, there's probably more formal methods of people getting involved now. Right? D do we have like actual student clinical rotations through physical therapy schools? Internships that are a little bit more strategically set up or their residency's. W what are some of the opportunities that you would tell somebody now, if they were in your position when you were getting started?

Aaron: 13:58

Yeah. So the answer is yes and no to all of that. And it's very team dependent. Um, and the reason I say that is because now in the NFL and I can't speak for baseball. That's your domain, the NFL, every team medical. From a physician standpoint is sponsored by a local, you know, health care management organization here in Kansas city. We happen to be sponsored by KU med, which makes sense, right. It's regional. So there's a lot of different opportunities based upon teams. Some medical staffs have decided to offer a residencies or internship program for credit through local universities. That's not everybody. And. You can get on the professional football, athletic trainers website to find out about that P fats.com or, or decade new. Remember which one it is, but yes. So there's more varied opportunities. Yeah, it used to be, Hey, I'm just going to call up and ask to a lug, a water cooler for all summer and then, uh, you know, hopefully do a good job. It's way more sophisticated than that now. And I think that's a good thing to your point, because then what happens is you get more education out of it and it's not just grunt labor and listen. For all the conversation about we shouldn't do unpaid grunt internships and I get all that, but that's still a part of it, right? Like you still have to do some level of work on a day-to-day basis. Training camp training, capsular grind, spring training is a slaw. It there's no matter what we do in our profession as PTs or eighties or whatever, like there's, there's a, there's a manual aspect to it. And I think we're losing that as an edge too often, that work is physical, right? Like we, we still have to put ourselves out there. That's why we have to stay in shape. That's why we have to exercise. Um, because if not, I don't make it through the day lugging. Table out of my truck every day in my bag, out of my truck every day, that 35 timetables tables that I take. So, you know, I think that the mindset has become that while we are getting better at being an educated professional, we can't lose the edge of being a physically demanding profession as well.

Mike: 16:02

I love that. Yeah. And, and I think sometimes people underestimate maybe what it takes to do this. Right. And what it takes in terms of not only the. But even just like the mental commitment, you have to be prepared. You gotta, you have to be prepared to work 24 7, otherwise somebody else will. Right. So same thing with the internships. Okay. You want to demand a paid one, which trust me, I'd rather it be paid. I'd rather them all be paid, but somebody will do it for free. So, you know, if you always have that sort of competition, you just, you have to be able to like, be at least prepared for that. Right. So, so, so going off that a little bit, why don't you. People prepare. Why don't you walk us through a little bit of what it's like working in the NFL, because I, I love these, these, these parts of the stories too, right? Uh, in, in baseball, we talk about a day in the life a lot, just because every day is exactly the same. It's terrible. Right. But for you, I feel like it's, it's almost like, uh, almost like on a week to week basis, right? Like where your weeks are cyclical, where our days are cyclical. So what I I'd love to hear about a little bit is like what's a week. Like during the season in the NFL for somebody in the medical staff, the physical therapy team video, even the others, what's it like?

Aaron: 17:12

Yeah. So throw out training camp training camp is just its own unique monster where you get zero sleep and you're up all hours of the night and you, you that that's, that's not even talking about that. Okay. So you play a game on a Sunday, presumably you know, there's obviously exceptions to that. Monday morning is all hands on deck. Let's figure out what we got kind of thing. Right? Um, it's diagnosing of all the injuries by 10 or 12 in the morning, wherever you're at. It is, you know, MRIs, x-rays scans, doctor's office visits. And then by Monday, mid morning, you kind of have a decent picture or at least Monday late in the afternoon, you have a decent picture about what you got. Okay. So then you kind of do this Roundup and go like, okay, here's how we're going to attack this week. Tuesday really big Workday. Although, you know, you get there every day, you get there. 6:00 AM. That's just the way it is. Um, and you know, I would shower eat at work, which is great perk, but then you gotta be like ready to go. And so Tuesday's your big day of rehab? You know, you try to get people moving, whether it's in an ultra G or a HydroWorx pool, get the soreness worked out, really see where people are going to go, because guess what? Wednesday's right over there. And Wednesday coaches want people to practice again. And so you really only have 48 hours to diagnose, get people, moving, get people functional and hope that they can perform some fashion on Wednesday. Now, this is where the NFL has changed. In the last decade or so, where guys are getting a lot more off days, guys are getting, you know, things where they don't, they have play a rest days. That whole concept of load management that the NBA is bringing on is making its way to the NFL. Um, but practice starts Wednesday. Practice practice days are long and hot and tiring. And you know, on, even on practice days on Wednesdays and Thursdays, we see guys five times. Five times for either treatment or rehab sessions. And those could be guys that aren't going to play, or guys that are even going to play. Obviously the guys that are going to play take more precedent. The guys that aren't going to play still get work, but it's more off to the, you know, the back-burner because, you know, th th th the week.

Mike: 19:16

Right.

Aaron: 19:17

you know, Thursday is kind of the same thing. Wednesday and Thursday are basically the same is kind of a wind down day. If you're not ready by Friday morning, then probably not going to play. And then everything gets shoved to the following Monday and Tuesday for those people, right? Friday, you have a shorter day or you get out of the building at 5:00 PM instead of seven or 8:00 PM. And then Saturday, you have a very quick day from a team standpoint with practice. You're either jumping on a plane to go someplace Seattle, Denver, whatever, you get to go home at two o'clock and spend three or four hours with your family before you have to go back to the hotel for Saturday night treatments, which, uh, is a, is a discussion for another time. And then, you know, then, then it's game day, right? It's game day in game days. Beautiful crazy, hectic, chaotic dance of actual care and triage that you could ever imagine. I think the medical staff on game day, you know, we do our normal routine getting guys ready for the game, but then once the game starts, it's really triaged. You know, there's not many times now where you see guys get injured in an NFL game and then come back. That those days are dwindling quickly, in my opinion. Um, and you know, people are playing more for the future, the long haul and the season now, as opposed to every day in games, if a guide. Uh, you know, any kind of mild or moderate injury, he's more than likely not coming back, obviously then the other tiny tweaks and twinges and whatnot. And so it's really triaging, like getting guys ready to go again then for Monday, which again, the cycle starts all up again. Um, so take that time. 17, 18 now. Um,

Mike: 20:56

I, I was taking some crazy notes from my fantasy football league, to be honest with you too. So Friday morning, super important for, uh, for, you know, cause sometimes you get that guy, you're trying to figure out if you should put in your roster. But I mean, to me, the part that I think that's really unique that you're, you probably underestimate how good you get at certain things. You get really good at diagnosing things quick. You get really good. The prognosis because of, of the repetitions that you have, right? You have such good clinical judgment because you see so many injuries a week that you can kind of go through that. That's really neat. But one thing that I wanted to ask you about, which I think is really cool here is you have a 48 hour window to help people recover, to get ready for probably when. Physically taxing sports out there, right? Because you not only do you have repetitive injuries, but you have you've contact and hardcore traumatic type injuries. Right. Um, me as a baseball athletic trainer, I'm literally helping people clip fingernails and put contacts in their eyes. Right. And you have real injuries that are sometimes even life-threatening, but those 48 hour window. Right that you said there from Monday to Wednesday, I thought was really neat to kind of hear more about, because I feel like a lot of us could learn from that experiences. What are some of the things that you think are the most helpful ways to get athletes to recover that quick? So that way they can be prepared for Wednesday? Again, what are the things that you guys do?

Aaron: 22:27

Yeah. So the, the real easy answer is like, okay, let's talk about the best modalities in the world. And let's talk about all these fancy machines that do this, that do that. I'm going to throw every bit of that out the window. And I'm going to say movement. We, we, we preach to people everyday. Like, even if you're not hurt, let's set, let's set aside that you're not hurting. Did a gladiator thing for, you know, three hours, your body is trashed. Come into the athletic training room. Let's move. Let's, let's get in the HydroWorx, let's get into the, uh, the weight room. Let's get in the alter G let's just move. Let's do restorative yoga. Let's do something to flush your body out. Let's and you know, I'm not, I'm here for the discussion of all the science of how and when to do. I'm not saying that there's some sports scientists that are really going to get on me about the timeframes about doing this. But, um, we like, we like active recovery, right. As, as what we promoted as an entity. And we think that it really benefited our players quite a bit to come in and have movement sessions and, uh, you know, with, with diagnosed injuries, uh, we, we. We believe in rest, let's have active rest. Let's get things going in the right direction. So we, even if we can't make Wednesday, let's at least talk about Thursday for a partial and maybe a full on Friday. And so, you know, we started bargaining with that and my boss and I, we would stand on the sidelines and go, okay, that guy that just went inside, he's a two to three week deal. I can get him back in 10 days. No you can't. Yes, I can. No, I can't yet. Okay. So that, okay. That guy that's coming off. He should be back by Wednesday. We gotta have him. He's really important. So this conversation is just even during the game, like if something happened in the second quarter, we're talking about Monday and Tuesday morning already. And so like, it's just a constant, constant communication and, um, kind of slotting people where they're going to fit in that recovery process.

Mike: 24:15

And, and I like how you, you focus less on the passive treatments and more on the act of recovery. And I think as we learn more about the physiology of all these. That's going to prove out to be scientifically accurate, right? Is you look at the, the trauma from east centric, contractions and traumatic injuries, those types of things. It's, it's, it's more about getting the moving because you don't have the luxury of just saying like, oh, take six weeks off and it'll heal up, but sure. But we have

Aaron: 24:41

Yeah, you baseball guys with hamstrings, like. I'm a couple of weeks off. We have to have them ready for Wednesday.

Mike: 24:47

And we can't, we, we, we can't get them back by Wednesday. So, so that's another way we get to when this podcast is over and you get to help me with that because that's something we struggle with. But, uh, but absolutely. Yeah, no, it's, it's absolutely crazy. Um, so you get a ton of injuries, obviously, right? Tell, tell me a little bit about how you work as a team. How does the physical therapists work with the athletic training crew with the strength coaches, even the skill coaches? Like how does that work? How do you all collaborate together during.

Aaron: 25:14

Yeah. So I had a great boss that was good at, uh, facilitating all this conversation. Right. All my time with league, I worked for the same person in the same head coach. So I was blessed in that regard. Um, so, uh, it is rare. It's very rare to have that. So I think. You know, being a dual credential person, I wear both hats. I love them both. And I hate them both all at the same time. Right. And so the way I look at it is there's, there's athletic trainers that can out rehab me and I can out acute care. Some of the oldest athletic trainers in the world, like we can all be good at our jobs and all live in the same pool and not get mad at each other. Right. And so it's constant communication. We all have our strengths and weaknesses. And I think doing so, especially when it comes to getting guys back in and diagnosing injury, right. Because you know, in a professional sports team, you don't wait two days to find out the diagnosis. You ship them in an MRI in the first 48 hours or 24, for sure. And then you have that information and go, okay, well, this is what he can do in the weight room. I got to go talk to the strength coach. This is what he can do here for rehab. I got to talk to. Who's ever coordinating his rehab, whether it would be me or one of the other athletic trainers, let's, let's discuss this and then let's take him, keep in mind what that person has to do. Is this person a backup, does they have to play all four phases of specialty? Do they have to take contact later in the week? Because it's a starting linebacker, like all of that factors into it. And so the communication between all of those parties has to be so open and so frequent that if not like stuff breaks down and. Lot of bad things come from that.

Mike: 26:44

I can see that. too. And, and if you don't work together, you're not going to get guys back as fast in time is the essence for you, right? I mean, man, you got six days to get people back from gigantic injuries that often take normal people four to six weeks. So I don't know how you guys do that. That's that's, that's really impressive. So, all right.

Aaron: 27:04

we hit a lot, but we also missed a lot too, so.

Mike: 27:08

I guess it's just, it's it, it is impressive. The, and you gotta, you gotta think that it's because of that strict collaboration that you've all bought into almost right. And hopefully we're at a day and age where that's not as, as much of an issue as it used to be, but like having everybody working together, right. Like one big thing we have with the white Sox is we have a daily meeting where every department's in on that. And we go over each player in the, in the plan for the day. And if, if anybody were to leave that meeting and not have a clear understanding or, or maybe even a disagreement with the approach for that day, that's first off, it's unacceptable, but really it never happens because you have that time to all get on the same page and wow. Does it make the care for the player so. much better when you're working together? And it's more fun for us, right.

Aaron: 27:57

Yeah, for sure. We had a big board that we'd all sit around Monday afternoon, going, okay, this guy's got this, this, this, this is his date of injury. This is what we think he's going to be at. Who's going to take care of his rehab. You know, this would be, you got to have this guy back by Thursday because the goal line package on Thursday is big for him. Cause he's a defensive tackle, blah, blah, blah. So you know, it all plays a role, right? And without all that communication, it's just, it's a mess.

Mike: 28:19

Right. Right. And I I'm, I I'm ex I want to work in the NFL now and I've never wanted to, but I'm all pumped up from this conversation. Cause it's, I mean, it is exciting. It is right. It's exciting to be on those meetings and you're together with a team and you're helping the best of the basket back as fast as they can. I mean, you guys are the best of the best and it shows.

Aaron: 28:41

Well, we, we definitely tried to do our best with those guys. It's getting harder and harder every day, but, uh, you know, as the guys get bigger and more physical and the injuries tend to get worse, but, uh, uh, hats off to the people that do it everyday.

Mike: 28:54

I know for sure, for sure. So I I'm excited about it, but I also love asking this question to people that have been through pro sports, but, um, now that you're out, like what's one of the things that you think you're gonna miss the most and then just for fun, what's the thing that you probably won't miss it at all.

Aaron: 29:10

Th the first answer is the same every single time. And it's not the work I missed the work. The work was cool. I miss the BS in the training room. And because we had a policy in our training room where there was nothing off topic, like you could not, you could not be upset. Basically. If somebody came after you for, they were joking about your girl or your mama or anything, and everybody was fair game

Mike: 29:37

Right.

Aaron: 29:38

you know, um, I'm not the world's biggest guy, you know, like I'm 5, 9, 180 5 on a good day.

Mike: 29:44

That's huge

Aaron: 29:45

be talking to like a 6, 6, 6, 3, 20 guy. Like we'd be talking crap to each other. And you know, like that, that's what I miss. I miss the comradery. I miss the togetherness to being in the training room. that that cannot be replaced. It just cannot, even if you're out hanging with your friends, it's a different environment and it goes beyond, uh, now it goes beyond age and gender and race, and everybody's, you know, if you're there in that environment, it's a team and everybody's working toward the same thing and that's those players and support staff and coaches and everybody so that I missed.

Mike: 30:20

it's a, it's a family for sure. I, and, and I think that's an important part is that you kid around like brothers and sisters do right. And, and I think that's part of that team building process to an extent, uh, W what about Sundays. though? What about, I mean, Sundays, like,

Aaron: 30:35

I hated Sundays.

Mike: 30:36

really that's because the excitement of it. playing Phil Collins, like for pregame, right? Cause every

Aaron: 30:42

That's you guys, the fans, the people in the field are like 10,000 miles an hour and players are shouting each other coaches everywhere. No, no, no. Give me inside. Like, that'd be go back. Cause.

Mike: 30:54

Okay. What about the playoffs though? Because you've been with some pretty outstanding teams, right? The playoffs though. That's that's

Aaron: 31:01

you get to play off, get jammed up a little bit. Like you give, you get pretty fired up. I've been told to shut up a couple of times, yelling back at refs and things like that on the sideline. And, you know, the playoffs gets you amped up and I was not fortunate enough to ever make it to a super bowl game three minutes away. I thought that was pretty, pretty cool. I got to work a couple pro bowls. That was cool. Um, you know, There's certain moments, especially get your team rivals, that kind of thing, where you get a little bit extra juice, but, um, you know, Sundays were just okay to me. I liked the rehab side things. I'm a nerd like that. I like, I like putting people back out there and then hopefully they perform

Mike: 31:37

Right. And that's why you're so good at your job. Is that was your, that was your focus, of course. All right. So w what's the, what's the thing you're not going to miss.

Aaron: 31:43

Packing trunks.

Mike: 31:48

I mean, there's.

Aaron: 31:49

trunks. I was in charge of my last five years and I hated every second. Counting this counting that, counting this. Okay. Check that off the list every week. That was my least favorite thing to do on Tuesday afternoons to get it done for the rest of the week. Nah. Nope, I'm done. I'm

Mike: 32:04

And it takes you away from what you love and what you're passionate about too, is helping the guys too. So it's not like, it's not like you, you, you know, I mean, there's always like crap, parts of every job. Right. But, uh, but yeah, I mean, it's, it's not the hands-on stuff. It's not as rewarding. So I can see that for sure. That's that's, that's a good one. I'm glad I asked that because. So, um, awesome. All right, Erin, I like ending with, uh, um, although the jury is still out here, I'm calling it the high five, but I'm getting some heat that it's maybe a little too corny to call it the high five. So, um, again, I'm going to again, throw it out there to the listeners if you want to change it. But anyway, five quick. Quick questions, five quick answers. And I think what it does is really help the listeners understand a little bit about you as a person and hear a little bit about the way your brain thinks. And I think there's some good. valuable lessons that come from these. But first question is what are you currently doing right now? What are you reading or what are you working on? What are you doing for your own content or professional development right now?

Aaron: 33:00

Uh, professional development. I'm always trying to be a better parents. Um, I've discovered that, um, that that's a part of me that I didn't ever know that it was going to need this much work, um, con ed. Uh, so I'm reading some parental parenting, you know, advice and cycle child psychology stuff. I know that sounds weird. I listened to a lot of. Uh, educational podcasts like the Mike Reinold show, and to learn some things. Um, and cause I'm not great at absorbing research. I listened to people who talk about research studies because I do better listening to it than I do reading it. And so, um, I try to listen to a lot of educational podcasts, even if it's not about PT, if it's whatever, you know, stuff that's covering. Heavier stuff. Right. And so I absorbed stuff better cause I'm in my truck so much for work. Um, so that's what I'm on right now. I am reading a fascinating book called the lion Tamers guide to life that I think is fantastic. I'm trying to get through that. It's a quick read. Um, a couple other light things though. I'm kind of in a rut, right? They also, if you have any suggestions. Um, on that, I I've been doing a lot of, uh, reading on DFR and Achilles repair stuff since I've, there's a pretty big chunk of Achilles repairs is my kind of bread and butter. Um, what I've kinda gotten known for is taking care of Achilles repair. So I'm doing a lot of, uh, in-depth BFR stuff.

Mike: 34:18

and there's so many Achilles tears in the NFL. Now that that's going up, right. It seems like there's way more every year.

Aaron: 34:24

well, we can talk about why on a separate podcast, because I know the reason why, but, um, it it's it's, uh, it's, it's, it's an epidemic, so we didn't use to have.

Mike: 34:34

right. Yeah, for sure. I mean, it's great in a training camps, like wow. Like the numbers you get in the summer. It crazy. So, um, awesome. All right. So what's one thing that you've recently changed or evolved your thoughts on.

Aaron: 34:47

Oh, man. There's not just one. There's a lot. Um, you know, in our profession, things are constantly going into and out of fat and then they'll come back around in five, 10 years. Um, I get, uh, I've changed my thought on getting upset at people, being upset with certain things that we know have worked over time. Right. And so, you know, there's this huge craze about manual therapy right now in our profession. And listen, I am not the world's biggest manual therapy. I think it has a place. Um, I there's there's. I am tired of people, taking things for the sake of taking things out of what we do to help people. And you know, it's not for everybody and it may not be effective for everybody, but for a certain person that I try to get people to move better. And if, if a little bit of manual therapy gets them feeling better in order for them to go do an extra set or an extra bout of exercise, then I'm down with that. Cause then the juice is then worth the squeeze. So that's what.

Mike: 35:47

That's great. And I think you could probably argue that those 48 hours that we just talked about would be a lot more challenging without manual therapy. Yeah, for sure. And there's, there's definitely a place, so that's awesome. All right. What's one big piece of advice that you'd give a student or an early career professional right now. What's your number one?

Aaron: 36:10

Um, quit worrying about grades in school and start worrying about how you're going to apply the things that you learn.

Mike: 36:19

I like

Aaron: 36:19

And, and because that's where it matters. I, I, I love him to death. And I had a roommate in college who was a presidential scholar can quote you the book, every book that there was right when he got in front of the people, um, couldn't couldn't do anything. And so I think for students, especially, it's not about. What you learned? Cause I carry books with me every day. I forget silly things for instance, in your world. I forgot, you know, all the major thoracic outlet Ceci of the day. So I brought a book with me to the patient's house and I don't care. Like I don't have any, I don't have any shame about not remembering everything. And so getting hung up on that stuff as opposed to how you apply it and how you bring it to people, I think is the big focus right now for students.

Mike: 37:01

That's that's great advice. Uh, next one is what's coming up next for you. What's new for Aaron.

Aaron: 37:08

Uh, really cool stuff. A company that I've partnered with called my health. That we're doing a lot of forward-thinking app based rehab for the masses. And I've been very fortunate to become an advisor for that company and joined up and write a bunch of their protocols. And, you know, we're, we're trying to. Especially now with COVID and increased premiums, uh, trying to get, uh, some more independent rehab out there. People that can do it with guided work, uh, through app based stuff. Uh, so that's, what's on my next horizon that I've been working on a lot in my free time, my free time. Um, you know, those late nights writing exercise protocols at my office desk, uh, right now. Uh, so we're really excited about that. My health Trek is, uh, the name of the company.

Mike: 37:54

That's great. And congrats on that. That sounds ambitious. I'm excited to see the future of that. Um, great. And then last, how do we learn more about you. Where can people find you? I know you're on social media websites stuff, but what's the best place to come find you.

Aaron: 38:07

Uh, all over Twitter and Instagram, a rehab all-star again, one of those names that I picked a long time ago that I probably should have changed,

Mike: 38:15

I kinda like it. I like It

Aaron: 38:17

doesn't pigeonhole me into any one thing. So, um, you know, I did it based upon the fact that you put anything in front of me and I'll try to take care of it. Um, I'm, I'm pretty active on social media. I like to talk and I like to get better, um, and learn things on social media because I don't know everything as far from it. Uh, so that's where you can find me. My website's just Boardman rehab solutions.com. Um, and then, uh, you know, happy to talk to anybody about anything.

Mike: 38:46

And that's, that's a pretty special thing to say. So, um, I appreciate that. Take them up on that Please find Aaron on social media, especially on Twitter, where I know I see them, uh, uh, talking all day. So it's, it's great to have you on there, but, uh, but again, thanks for sharing all this great stuff on the podcast for everybody. I know a lot of people are going to get a lot of benefit from this. So thanks for being on today, Aaron.

Aaron: 39:06

No problem. Thanks for having me, Mike.